Denise Billen-Mejia 0:07
Welcome to Two hypnotherapists talking with me, Denise Billen-Mejia in Delaware, USA.
Martin Furber 0:13
And me Martin Furber in Preston UK.
Denise Billen-Mejia 0:16
This weekly podcast is for anyone and everyone who would like to know more about fascinating subject of hypnosis and the benefits that it offers.
Martin Furber 0:24
I'm a clinical hypnotherapist and psychotherapist,
Denise Billen-Mejia 0:27
I'm a retired medical doctor turned consulting hypnotist.
Martin Furber 0:31
We are two hypnotherapists talking.
Denise Billen-Mejia 0:34
So let's get on with the episode.
Martin Furber 0:35
Okay, so yeah, let's cut over the show indeed, Denise, please introduce our guest this week.
Denise Billen-Mejia 0:41
I'm really excited to be introducing Heather because we're brand new friends, we just came across each other in a group that was nothing to do with hypnosis and said, Oh, a hypnotist! And very kindly, Heather came early this morning because she's up in Calgary, Canada. And I'm in Delaware. And Martin is in Preston. And this is a worldwide movement to get people to understand that hypnosis is really useful. So Heather, thank you so much for joining us today. Where would you like to start? Would you like to explain how you found out about hypnosis? It's always fascinating.
Hypno Heather 1:18
Sure, oh Sure. Thank you so much for having me. I'm glad that you picked me out of that group. Oh, I mean, I have a couple of stories about how I found hypnosis. But the main one was really after over a decade of doing my own self healing and trying different modalities and really delving into the world of you know, heal thyself and trying things. I had a moment where I was like, oh, right, hypnotherapy. And it was at a time in my life when I was feeling like I'm fully aware of why I'm doing the things, or maybe how I got here, what the programming is, what the childhood stuff was like. But I really was just having to succumb to the involuntary triggers and responses. And I knew that it was part of my conditions, like I had some skin and lung conditions. And so I looked it up online, I found a training close to me, it started right away, I took my baby and my family, you know, to another city and started the training. And it really was as soon as I was in the training, starting to become a Hypnotherapist. I had a huge release and moment that I just knew everybody needs to know about this.
Denise Billen-Mejia 2:49
Very similar to mine. I was a physician, I had to retire because of health. And I thought I was going to be a health coach. I trained as that because it's something that my brain wasn't working. And I just happened across an introduction to hypnosis. And I took a week off, which I thought I was just gonna have some idea. And I went, Whoa, this is what I should have been doing for years. And I was so furious when I found out that our respective Medical Association's agreed back in the 50s when Elman and Boyne, and all those people were were training. And still, we're fighting that. No, it's not woo-woo it really is a real thing. No chickens needed.
Speaker 3 3:34
Yeah, it's so interesting how we got just eliminated, from psychology
Martin Furber 3:43
It's the same over here Heather, in the UK, we have the I think it's the National Institute for Clinical Excellence. Nice. They set the guidelines for healthcare and one thing and another, and make the recommendations and they recommend hypnotherapy for so many things, but our National Health Service won't pay for it.
Speaker 3 4:01
Yeah, yeah. You know, I think that's what's been so helpful for me in my career, you know, being in this for so long. When I really look back, all I did to grow my business was to teach people about hypnotherapy, and really what it can do. And because it was more of the fact that people didn't know and, like me, tried so many other things before getting to it. And then some people just never get to it because they don't really understand how effective it is.
Denise Billen-Mejia 4:37
Yeah, it's I had an initial consult with a gentleman yesterday and he was saying, Well, I want to do, it because I had, it was for fear of flying. Because I have to do something but I don't understand why it would work. I said, that's okay, just believe it will. It's like my mother's theory on flying, you know, I don't know how it stays up there. I'm not really going to get on that thing. It took her years to take her first flight. So, so what did, what was your career prior to hypnosis? Before you had the baby?
Speaker 3 5:10
I did. But I actually had a career in hospitality. Like I manage restaurants. I had a gourmet catering company with my husband at the time. And yeah, I had a customer service bachground. I built my business by, I had clients or customers, I guess, that would come in to different restaurants that I worked in. And so once I found hypnotherapy, I would say to my customers, like, oh, my gosh, like I do sessions. And that's really how I built my business.
Denise Billen-Mejia 5:47
That's great.
Martin Furber 5:48
Did you find though, the background in the hospitality trade, gave you that experience of being able to just listen to people and build that rapport? Because, you know, in the hospitality trade, a good rapport is essential, isn't it?
Hypno Heather 6:04
Yeah. Yeah. I joke because when I used to manage other people, like waitstaff and such, and they would be grumpy in the back, or like kind of mad at customers, I would say, you know, you got the wrong job. Like, I'd be happy, like getting people the things you ask, they ask for. That's literally your job. So I think that yes, but it's also a type of person that likes to do that type of work.
Denise Billen-Mejia 6:34
The thing I think the two of you have an advantage over me for was, I was in emergency meds, I did paeds too, too, but I mostly worked in emergency medicine. So I was completely divorced from the billing, I had people yelling at me to put the right codes down so they could bill. So I'm always, I'm way better than I was at first, but it's so hard to tell people I want money from them. I'm not the most expensive I've ever heard of, but I do know, and I will do sliding scale for people. But I honestly I think if people said no, I'm not going to come if you're going to charge me money, I'd probably say that's okay then. Which is really silly, because in order to do the things that my ambition for is to get this in front of more doctors. So I need more clients. So they can go back to their doctor, I always require them to give me permission to talk to their doctors, to get more people, and they'll have a living client, patient client, who has had success with hypnosis. And that's what doctors need to see that it works for regular people.
Speaker 3 7:39
Very true. I've had lots of recommendations from doctors over the years, I had one doctor, all of his patients basically because of one that I'd helped. But I think that's also really great of you to share that with your listeners, you know, the things that you're still learning for yourself and the parts that are hard. Because that's the aspect of doing this type of work. And being a healing entrepreneur, that it's often difficult because we're not just in the role of helping people. We're also entrepreneurs and business people because you don't become a hypnotherapist and then look through the paper to find a job.
Denise Billen-Mejia 8:21
Yeah, exactly. You know, maybe in really large. I think in New York City, you might have a chance to do that. But there's also a lot of hypnotists in New York City. Here in Delaware, there's very few. I have my first clients, I had like two or three in a row who said, Oh, my therapist told me to see a hypnotist two years ago. But they just said, Go see a hypnotist, and didn't give them any guidance on how to find one. So I was the first one they met. So which was nice, because I had three clients one, two, three, but it's a disservice to them not to be visible.
Speaker 3 8:57
I mean, for me, that sounds great. Because when I started like 12 years ago, nobody was ever recommending it. And now, you know so many people talk about it on podcasts, like people will come and say, Oh, I heard on a podcast like now there's blogs about it. Like there's so much more awareness about it now that I just think it's awesome that a therapist is even saying that.
Denise Billen-Mejia 9:23
I just think there's a confusion about terminology, I think all the time. There are people who practice hypnosis but only use, there's one or two techniques that they use. And that's that's very true. We all know about avatars and how we're supposed to have an ideal client, but it helps with so many things. How can you say I'm sorry, I only do weight, go away smoker, when there is so many things that you can help people with. And it just so frustrating for me. I'm sorry, Martin. I overstepped!
Martin Furber 9:54
No, no, not at all. Not at all. At No, I was going to ask, Heather, tell me a bit more about your practice. All I know is you're in Calgary, Canada. Tell me, give me a picture.
Denise Billen-Mejia 10:05
And it's snowing today!
Hypno Heather 10:09
We got this snow like snow.
Martin Furber 10:12
So tell me more about your practice. Are you online? Are you mainly online? Do you have a face-to-face operation?
Hypno Heather 10:19
Yeah, so I built my business as an in-person Hypnosis Training and in person hypnotherapy practice, up until to 2020. So in Saskatchewan, Canada, so and then the province colder and not too far from here. And then in 2020, I went online, like so many people. And then I just stayed online because I actually had a training booked, I was starting to expand to other cities to do my training, and they were booked, and then everything got shut down. So everyone still wanted to learn and so I moved it all online. And in those days, I just did like full days of zoom like we would in person. Whereas now I have an online portal where they get weekly videos that are pre-recorded. And then they also have it forever, which, once I got online, I love the model so much because of something like that, where they have access to the content of the training. So once they start practising, they can come back to it because some of it you don't even really get until you're really in it. And that's all the stuff that's in my training just like all the stuff I wished I knew along the way and then with my personal practice, I also kept it online because I felt like once I was able to cross over the threshold so to speak, and I could feel what the client was feeling like I could when they were in person it took me about two months to get to that where it really happened, I thought hey keep doing this, it works, it works, and where I felt really confident in it. I kept it online then and because of the results being better, the convenience being able to work with people all over the world, but also for my own location freedom. It just fit all the boxes. And I still do one on one hypnotherapy although I have longer programmes.
Martin Furber 12:24
Did you find Heather then, as you sort of changed over from face to face to online, we look for different signals now don't we in the face that we did previously? You know, we when we see somebody face to face, we're looking for entire body language. But I've found my sort of talents at being able to read facial expressions far better, since going online, I love doing online. I absolutely love it. Like you say it expands your client base doesn't it around the world?
Hypno Heather 12:58
Well, you know for me, I do limited one on one hypnotherapy. I have longer programmes because I work with mostly complex issues because I'm the trainer of so many of the people like I have so much experience but also most of my one on one work right now is coaching other hypnosis professionals to build their business and do tack, I even write copy for them and their programmes and their pricing because there's just so many aspects to the business part of hypnosis that like Denise was saying, we need that work.
Denise Billen-Mejia 13:40
Actually, can I ask a tangential question, but for the hypnotists watching this now, she didn't just get successful once she was online, I think there's a fear that it takes years and years and years. It's not, you don't walk out with your little diploma and have 50 people at your door. But you can become self-sustaining with some work, and it's a good idea to get into a business coaching, just that, most of the schools teach so you know, this is what a business card looks like. This is what a flyer is, right nobody does that anymore. So up to date business coaching is really important and support just knowing other hypnotists, because we often, especially if we're taking online courses, we don't have that interaction.
Hypno Heather 14:34
I have so much to say about that. I have so much to say to that. I'll make, I'll put it in a little package for you.
Denise Billen-Mejia 14:42
Okay, great. They'll be in the show notes.
Hypno Heather 14:45
Yeah, this is it. You know, there's there's a couple of different aspects to this that I find are generally missing from somebody wanting to build a sustainable, profitable, ideally full-time. practice. You know, my practice has been full time for over 10 years, it's my only thing, it pays for all my bills for all my son's bills, everything, I haven't done anything else since. And the first thing most people don't like to hear. But what it really is if you're putting yourself in a position where you're helping others, if you're not actually continuously increasing your capacity within yourself and starting to understand your own mind, and really finding ways to improve. I don't really like self improvement or self development, but more in the sense of like, tune into yourself, feel through your own stuff. So you're not coming to your sessions, diagnosing people or thinking you're the authority over them. That's first and foremost, you know, like, the more you expand your capacity, the more people will come to you whether you have a great marketing plan or website or not. And that's where we need help, right? Like, who's gonna buy a package from you if you never bought a package from somebody else? Like, it just doesn't happen. And then the second thing is the business coaching, you know, I find it's just, it's just, well, we do have the resources within ourselves, like for our life and to handle anything in our life. We really don't create a successful profitable business if we don't hire other people to help us do it. Like I have two coaches right now.
Denise Billen-Mejia 16:35
I think you need to have been in a coaching role a while before that stops sounding weird. But aren't they supposed to have fixed you? Why would you need another one? Well, because the goalposts move when you achieve something you can see a little bit further.
Hypno Heather 16:53
Well, and you just don't know, what you don't know, and you can learn. I learned a lot along the way that, now when I look back, if I had had some coaching in some areas, I would have been less, like not necessarily less challenging, but there's some things I would have known like, even now, I'm looking into like what, you know, what don't I know? Because it's, it's okay. It's just a slower grind.
Martin Furber 17:21
Hmm. Yeah.
Hypno Heather 17:23
You know, that being said, though, I do find this happens. This is a bit of a plague in the hypnosis industry, which I find that people do tend to just keep taking courses. And don't just get going. So I don't want to say this and create any limiting beliefs about oh, you need more help you need someone else telling you what to do, because that is not coaching. And that is not help. That's just you trying to fit into someone else's box and never feeling confident.
Denise Billen-Mejia 17:54
Yeah, it's also yes, you may have impostor syndrome, but there are a lot of people out there who can help you. What's your favourite client to work with? Not a particular person, but what's what is your favourite issue to work with? What do you get the most satisfaction from working?
Hypno Heather 18:15
Relationships, moving on from feeling relationships. I do a lot of I do coaching. I do three principles coaching, which is mind consciousness and thought. And it's really about understanding how the mind works and how we experience life from the inside out. And so for me, with relationships is I love it, because it's all of our relationships, bring up the parts in ourselves that are looking for light or looking for healing or looking for a release. So that's why I love that word, because it always gets to the juicy deep stuff.
Denise Billen-Mejia 19:00
How do you handle the question, How long will it take?
Hypno Heather 19:04
Oh, well, I have a few different most of my answers to that are a joke. So I don't know if you... you know, because sometimes I'll say like, probably a lifetime in some ways.
Denise Billen-Mejia 19:17
Because we're based on a psychoanalysis of Freud. Yes.
Hypno Heather 19:21
But you know, some things I obviously know, I have pretty accurate timelines. Like there's some things I know how many sessions but I, because I work with complex issues, you know, it's not so much about solving an immediate problem like if it's a fear or phobia, or say quitting a you know, quitting smoking or these types of things, changing a habit, obviously, all of that is very quick. When it's like unravelling, you know, the self and getting to the true self. Well, there's layers to that so, so for me, even with my students, I'll say You know, we just work with them, for as long as they work with us. I can get them to a higher place.
Denise Billen-Mejia 20:03
It's hard for them to hear that, when when that's running their life, you say it. Yeah. Sometimes it takes a few sessions, but that's it works the best, and Martin's heard me say it so many times, I had somebody with fear of driving over bridges. And it was an online, even though he was fairly local to me. I watched this, I saw when it happened. I mean, it just went away. Two days later, he hadn't told me he was going on vacation. Two days later, he texted me after he was finished driving across the Bridge. And my wife said, I was looking around and laughing. And that was just I mean, he's just, it was just so wonderful. And he said, Do you do weight? Well, yes, I do, and he became a weight client. It's just, yeah, it's wonderful to be able to help. And so frustrating that it's still got that woo-woo label.
Martin Furber 20:56
Yeah, getting back to what you said about complex issues. Because I have one or two clients that have been quite long term, I would say, I think with the clients, I'm generalising from my clients, by the way, but clients with complex issues tend to take longer to build that rapport for them to want to open up and explain everything to you. And for them to feel that confidence in you. I mean, obviously, they're confident enough to come and see, see me in the first place. But I do feel it takes that longer for them to build that trusting bond before they sort of start to reveal all layers of a complex issue, as you say. You said about peeling the layers back of an onion then didn't you?
Denise Billen-Mejia 21:38
I think that's sometimes because they've been down so many roads, trying to find an answer. This is 20th person I have to explain this to. There's CBT, there's you know, there's just so many.
Hypno Heather 21:52
I think that it's not even so much about the hypnosis or the misconceptions, I think it's actually more about that it's very hard, it's very hard to just start to ask for help, and then start to reveal the parts of ourselves like that. We ultimately would just be honest about how we're feeling to even start to get help. So that's even what I'm hearing in what you're saying.
Denise Billen-Mejia 22:21
Because it's their subconscious, they aren't actually examining the reasons, very often. They're just, this is what they do. This is how they respond to this, the stressor that's coming out.
Hypno Heather 22:32
I think it seems like a weakness to ask for help. I think this is happening with the practitioners too.
Denise Billen-Mejia 22:38
Yeah.
Hypno Heather 22:39
You know, like we're saying, you know, you probably need a business coach, but keep going on your own, which is fine. It's just, I think that sometimes that's the first like, when I think about, I do a lot of work with marketing for the practitioners. And so I always think about what does the person? So, I'll share this with you actually, it's a belief, it's about hypnotists, but also is about marketing. I have a YouTube video on it, actually. I have it. Yeah. And I'll put some free, I'll put some free downloads in the comments on that YouTube video. So here's the thing that I found to be awesome about being a hypnotist and being a marketer, because we already have more knowledge than like most about how the belief systems work. And so what I found is, like so you know, when you're doing a session, even like you were talking about Martin, it's like really getting them from island A to island B, where they are, where they want to be. And then ultimately, getting them from island A to island B is shifting the beliefs. What do they believe now, that's keeping them on island A, what do they need to believe to get them to island B. Bear with me? Right?
Martin Furber 23:57
Absolutely.
Hypno Heather 23:58
Okay, so then with marketing, it's the exact same. It's like, what do they need to believe, to buy in? Like, what are they need to believe? What do they believe now? And what do they need to believe to say, Yes, I'm in. So that could be different things. So this is where my brain was going the last few days with this, because I'm always thinking like this. And so if you think about it, if they first need to believe that it's okay, look, I'm giving away my secret to my next product here. You guys got me! Because maybe now you'll start to read my email, like on my email list, you'll see Oh, I see what Heather's doing there. But you're getting the inside secrets. But let's think about this for a second because everybody goes out and starts saying hypnotherapy is awesome. It can help with this and this and this and this, but you've got the person sitting there and they still haven't moved from believing that they that there's help. Like, let's say the belief is, it's weak to get help moving them from Island Ato B, where they say I'm open, would be helping them first believe that it's actually not a weakness to ask for help and keep looking for help, even if you've already tried before. So what we're seeing here is more, this is better than niching, right? Because this is really looking at, like, say you do work in a certain area, maybe somebody with anxiety would first need to start to believe that it's possible, that there's actually help out there, whatever it is, but it's also possible that this could improve. And so then it becomes a lot easier to merge it because you're talking to people not to the technique, or the process. And I might be sounding like a bit of a hypocrite right now. Because I did build my business teaching people what hypnosis was, and how it could help. But we're in a different era right now. We're in a different era, people can Google that all the time, they can find that easily. Now there's tonnes of information about the science of hypnotherapy, and what it can help with and people still might want to know, oh, what it could help with a fear of bridges? Like it's amazing how many use that, that use hypnosis for that exact problem.
Denise Billen-Mejia 26:25
So it's a quite common problem!
Hypno Heather 26:29
It's actually is, so that's still okay. But what we're really looking at is like, where are the belief shifters? So getting them to like, so say somebody is wanting to do weight loss. I specialised in weight loss for years, and they want to bring in weight loss clients. I mean, there's a lot of obvious things that we could say about how hypnosis helps with weight loss. And we could ask chat, GPT and it would tell us a whole list, you know, this information is readily available. And but at the same time, what does, and this is where the ideal client is better than niching, what does your person that you'd like to work with, believe now, that is ultimately, not stopping them from losing weight, but is actually stopping them from seeing that shifting their beliefs will help them lose weight?
Denise Billen-Mejia 27:26
Right!
Martin Furber 27:28
Right. Okay. And people can find out more about this from your video on YouTube. Is it, or from your website?
Hypno Heather 27:34
I mean, this is for practitioners. Yeah. But yeah. Using your hypnosis skills to market your business.
Martin Furber 27:40
This has whet my appetite.
Hypno Heather 27:46
I'm actually recording today, so I might just record something else too.
Martin Furber 27:52
Yeah, well, we're gonna we're gonna put a link to your website in the show notes on our YouTube thing, and we're almost at the top of the hour, and I know you're in a rush. So please, the floor is yours. Please say your final words to our viewers and listeners Heather. What would you like to say about hypnotherapy about yourself about your practice. The floor is yours.
Hypno Heather 28:11
Wow, you know, I just want to say, first of all, thank you for sharing your space with me, you two, are such a delight, I would come talk to you anytime, recorded or not. I think it's just great for people to be listening, and being, you know, having you to talk about really where you're at and what you're doing. And I do think that that really helps with imposter syndrome and in the right sense. In that way, because the one thing I'm pretty sure we all have in common and probably a lot of people listening have in common is that we truly understand that this is their solutions, in a world and at a time, when people need real lasting solutions for mental and psychological health.
Denise Billen-Mejia 29:03
So in the show notes, there will be all the contact information for Heather.
Martin Furber 29:08
That's brilliant. Thank you. And thanks so much for coming on.
Denise Billen-Mejia 29:11
Thank you, and have fun at your recording.
Hypno Heather 29:15
I'll be thinking of you two, you gave me so much. You know I love talking to other people in the field and chatting with you two. You're so pleasant. I can't wait to listen to the other podcasts that you did.
Denise Billen-Mejia 29:32
Thank you so much. Thanks
Denise Billen-Mejia 29:43
We hope you've enjoyed listening. Please remember this podcast is designed to give you an insight into therapeutic hypnosis. It is for educational purposes only. So remember, consult with your own healthcare professional if you think something you've heard may apply to you or a loved one.
Martin Furber 29:59
If you found this episode useful, you can apply for free continuing professional development or CME credits. Using the link provided in the show notes. Feel free to contact either of us through the links in the show notes. Join us again next week.
